Watch the full interview below or listen to the full episode on your iPhone HERE.
Stu: This week we welcome Jema Lee to the show. Jema is a wellness coach, speaker, presenter and a huge ambassador for making healthy living easy and attainable for everyone. She blends ancient ancestral health and Ayurveda to guide women back into their balance.
In this episode we talk about the fundamental differences between men and woman, why low-carb and keto need to be carefully considered and how mapping out your monthly cycle could be the key to amazing health, enjoy…
Audio Version
Questions we ask in this episode:
- Does the perfect diet exist… what’s your philosophy on food?
- Where do you sit on low-carb / Keto for women?
- What health roadblocks are females more typically vulnerable to than males?
Get More of Jema Lee
- https://www.wellsome.com/
- https://www.facebook.com/wellsome.jemalee/
- https://www.instagram.com/wellsome_jemalee/
- Download the Free Cycle Tracker Here
If you enjoyed this, then we think you’ll enjoy this interview:
- Amy Myers: The Thyroid Connection
- Sara Gottfried: Hormones & The Younger Protocol
- JJ Virgin – Linking Food Intolerances to Weight Gain
Full Transcript
Stu
Hey, this is Stu from 180 Nutrition and welcome to another episode of the Health Sessions. It’s here that we connect with the world’s best experts in health, wellness and human performance in an attempt to cut through the confusion around what it actually takes to achieve a long lasting health. Now I’m sure that’s something that we all strive to have. I certainly do.
Before we get into the show today, you might not know that we make products too. That’s right. We’re into whole food nutrition and have a range of super foods and natural supplements to help support your day. If you are curious and want to find out more, just jump over to our website. That is 180nutrition.com.au and take a look. Okay. Back to the show.
[00:03:00] This week. I’m excited to welcome Jema Lee. Jema is a coach, speaker, presenter, and a huge ambassador for making healthy living easy and attainable for everyone. She blends ancient ancestral health and Ayurveda to guide women back into their balance. In this episode we talk about the fundamental differences between men and women, why low carb and keto needs to be carefully considered, and how mapping out your monthly cycle could be the key to amazing health. Over to Jema.
Hey guys, this is Stu from 180 Nutrition and I am delighted to welcome Jema Lee to the podcast. Jema, how are you?
Jema
I’m very well Stu. Thank you so much for having me on.
Stu
Honoured that you’re going to share your knowledge with our audience today as well because I think you’re super, super passionate, which is why I’m so particularly interested in having a chat with you today. But first up, I would love it for our audience that may not be familiar with you. If you could just share a little bit about yourself.
Jema
[00:04:00] Thank you. Yeah, I’m a women’s health educator. And what that means is I work with women around their periods basically. I’ve been in the nutrition industry for 13 years and I’ve been down this road of having my own health challenges and I really kind of along the way didn’t want to become a practitioner. I wanted to become a supporter and an educator, because I feel like education is one of the missing kind of components. So I went down this really long road of traveling and studying ancestral health. I’ve studied a little bit about women wisdom, I’ve studied nutrition, I’ve studied wellness coaching, I’ve studied Ayurveda I’ve studied Ayurveda psychology, there’s lots of different facets.
And I was always so interested in like, how did our ancestors used still live thousands and thousands of years ago that we no longer maybe use their kind of techniques and tools and traditions, that we could like bring into this modern world that we do today. So now that’s what I do and I work with women and helping them learn how amazing their bodies are.
Stu
Fantastic. Wow. Well we can take this in so many different angles, I’m sure.
Jema
We can.
Stu
[00:05:00] And certainly so much to learn from the past as well because oftentimes we think that it’s, the future is so bright and there’s all this new texts coming in. It’s going to make our lives so much easier. But I think perhaps a lot of that stuff can cloud perhaps some principles. And I guess pillars that used to work so well for so many thousands of years that we’ve forgotten about. So I’m really keen to explore that as well. I reckon, well, let’s start with the million dollar question then.
Jema
Okay go for it.
Stu
So tell me about the perfect diet, everything that you’ve learned then in your X number of years. And you’ve been doing this for a while now because we’ve been following you closely.
Jema
Yeah, I have.
Stu
The perfect diet. So does it exist? What’s your philosophy on food?
Jema
That’s such a multifaceted question, isn’t it?
Stu
It is.
Jema
[00:06:00]
[00:06:30] I believe the perfect diet does exist. However, the perfect diet is what’s perfect for you. So, when people look, everyone loves a label today. We love, like when I was diagnosed with leaky gut or when I got diagnosed with PCOS, I was labeled that you have this and this is who you are and you kind of, I like to make learning really simplistic. It’s like going into your closet in the morning and going, oh, what will I wear today? And oh, I’m gonna wear this jacket. And that’s the label I choose to wear for the day. So in the way in which we label things with food, it can get quite confronting and then we feel like we’re stuck into that label and we’re not, I believe in flow with ourselves. And as a woman particularly, and it’s important for men to know this too, is that we have different sides of us and being able to move, you’re not static.
[00:07:00] And the way in which I teach is in relation to nature. And you can’t be like a steady ocean because the ocean is ever changing. And so therefore the way that your body wants to eat is going to also ever change. So does the perfect diet exist? I think it does, but it’s really about discovering your body and then knowing what’s perfect for you and your body. And for women that looks completely different, than to men for many reasons. But when it comes to the philosophy around food is that if you eat close to nature, your body’s going to recognize the food.
[00:07:30] And as you know Stu I worked for seven years in food formulation for nutritional manufacturing. And I came from a background of doing that and seeing a lot of manufactured products today and not everyone knows what’s really in that product. Even if it says it’s natural. Because people don’t how do you get, you know, how does stevia go from being a plant and a leaf into a white powder. Like it is natural on the label, but how does that happen? Like it’s green and then it becomes bright white. So that process is really important. So I say if you eat close to nature, you can’t really go wrong.
Stu
Excellent. And I completely agree. And so tell me then about eating close to nature would be something I would imagine then from our own bodily perspective, will be something that will change. And it might be that from season to season you might trend into eating more vegetables and fruits at one time of the year and you’re getting into more warming meals and more protein in certain times of the year. Have you experimented with diets and found success and then moved on to something else for instance?
Jema
Definitely. When I was diagnosed with leaky gut from the outside perspective, I looked quite healthy. But on the inside I was like having a mini meltdown and I did look quite pregnant at the time too, but I just knew there was something wrong with my body and I went and I tried everything. You know, when my friend was like, oh, I have candida I’m going to do the candida diet for eight weeks, do you want to do it with me? I was like, okay. And so I think because I’ve tried so many different diet forms and structures, I’ve learned a lot about my body’s response to those.
So when it comes to seasonal eating, something that we always did is, ancestrally we didn’t have refrigerators and we had store rooms, you could say, depending on what part of the world you were from, but we didn’t have pantries. And what a lot of people don’t realize is that packaged food or even food in supermarkets, supermarkets haven’t even been around for 100 years yet.
Stu
My word. Is that true? That’s crazy.
Jema
[00:10:00] Yeah. The world today has changed dramatically in the last hundred years. And when you think about supermarkets, today we can go and just get convenient food. Like it’s winter where I am right now. And we don’t have a lot of the summer fruits available when I go shopping at the farmer’s market. But if I go to the grocery store, I can find them. So seasonal eating, I believe, when it comes to eating close to nature, is eating within your local area. So that’s eating based on the temperature, based on what they can grow with that area. And then really what your body likes to be nourished by.
[00:10:30] So as an example, ancestral teachings. So if you look at Ayurveda is that, and for those who don’t know what Ayurveda is, you’re listening and you’re like, what? I like to just refer to it as like traditional Indian medicine. Because everyone knows what traditional Chinese medicine is, but it’s Indian. And they’re quite closely related. So it’s an easy way to think about it. But when you look at the body, our body actually changes seasonally throughout the year.
[00:11:00] So in winter our digestive system is different and acts different to the way that it does in the peak of summer. So in summer we’re not only just generally wanting to be outside more, we want to move our bodies, we might like to do more running or go to the gym more or be more social or dance more, or whatever it might be. In winter you kind of want to do the whole modern Netflix and chill thing. So your digestive system is also different to your … like similar to how your lifestyle is different.
[00:11:30] So eating in season is one of the most foundational fundamental things to eating close to nature. And I believe that if you just trust your body and what it’s asking for, then your body always guides you. And I did a coaching session with a client this morning and her body naturally guided her through connection practice as to what she really needs support with. Whereas the minds, the thing that kind of takes over. So eating in season I think is like a huge fundamental.
Stu
Great, fantastic. I know, it does make so much sense. So how then how do you factor that into the trends that were hit with, because I’ve been in this company for a decade now and this was pre Paleo, pre keto, pre I quit sugar-
Jema
Powder.
Stu
[00:12:30]
Exactly right. It was just, and now we’re just bombarded and I think one of the most prevalent food or diet types at the moment is your low carb and possibly keto. And everybody’s trying it. Everybody’s doing a 16, 8 or they’ve got a fasting window here, they’re going high fat. But I think after speaking to lots of different people who have dedicated large chunks of their lives to this type of eating, I think that it’s not a one-size-fits-all and it could be quite different from a female to a male. There’s so much underlying stuff going on there. So I’d love your take on that as well.
Jema
[00:13:00] Okay. Let’s open a big can of worms. Shall we? I hope everyone listings going to really enjoy this. But when I first learned about this, it completely blew my tires. And you’re so spot on about, before we go there, about how different the food industry is. I came from a background of fashion, surprisingly, I studied fashion and I worked for one of the first companies who made swimwear and sold swimwear online. And this was 15 years ago and back then selling swimwear online was really like, but I haven’t tried it on like, how do I know if it’s going to fit me?
[00:14:00]
Fast forward today everyone buys everything online. And it’s the same with food. We forget how quickly trends do change. And food is an industry. So for people who like the new things that they’re constantly wanting the next bit of information or what’s the new thing I can do here? And I will never forget when it was all of a sudden Paleo was the really big thing. Or when quitting sugar was the big thing. And working in food manufacturing, I dealt with all the private clients and they would come in saying, well we want this product to be manufactured to this and we want it to have this much protein because this is the thing that’s in at the moment. And consumers forget that food is manufactured to be marketed to them.
[00:14:30] So when you think about that and eating close to nature, when it comes to men and women we’re made differently and the biggest differences between our bodies is our endocrine system. So to open that can of worms is that what a perfect diet or a way in which a woman would eat would look different to men. And I have had a lot of clients who come and they want to do the keto, right? And I work with women, so they’re wanting to do the keto. They’re like, oh, I’ve been trying it. I’ve been eating all the right foods, I’ve been moving my body, I go to the gym, I go to crossfit, I go to yoga, I all in this and I just can’t lose the extra 10 kilos. Or I still can’t conceive. I’m just, you know, having like fertility challenges or I still have PCOS or I have leaky gut or whatever it might be.
[00:15:30] What we don’t realize is that women and men are quite different. So a woman’s body works in a different hourly structure to a man’s body. So a man runs on what we call like a 24 hour hormone cycle. So in general, this is very generalized, a man wakes up and his hormones are the same at 8:00 AM in the morning as they are at 12 noon and then at like 8:00 PM every day, they’re quite the same. And for the women listening, yeah, I’m sure you all know a man in your life who kind of is like, been spending a bit of time working out what they like to eat, but then when they get it they’re like, yes, and they could just eat the same thing for 10 years. Every day the same.
[00:16:00] Whereas for women it’s kind of like, oh, but today I really want this food and the next day I kind of want that food. And today I want ice cream. And then the next day I want raw broccoli. Is that the woman’s body runs on what we call a 28 day cycle, not a 24 hour cycle. So for a woman, how their hormone level is today is only going to happen another 13 times in the next 365 days. No wonder we are different every day. And therefore we’re different in the way that we eat, the way that we move, the way that we feel, our emotions, our hormone balance. And that’s why the perfect thing is what’s perfect for you individually. Because every day as a woman is going to look very different.
Stu
[00:16:30] Wow, interesting. And interesting, I guess from a mood perspective as well because your hormones affect the way that you feel and think and perhaps act in the morning. So that puts a lot of things into perspective for me.
Jema
[00:17:00] Totally. And I know you’ve got daughters. So if you think of a group of women who all get together or like you and your family, is that all of those girls are running on slightly different cycles and some they will have a cycle, but they’re at different stages of their cycle. So when you go and you feed the family in your instance, is that you might have one woman in your family who’s post menstruation, one who’s pre menstruation, one who’s in ovulation. And so they all, you make the one meal, but they’re all going to eat it slightly differently. And it could be the most nourishing meal that comes from nature that is loaded with great protein sources and fat and fiber and all of that. But it doesn’t take into account that particular woman’s cycle.
Stu
[00:18:00]
Got it. Wow. Yeah. That, yeah, that sheds a new light on our household for sure. So the hormones like this H word, which can be so ambiguous and to frame it with a story, so about six months ago I was on an airplane flying to Melbourne and the inflight magazine had a great big full page ad and it was about thyroid issues. And it said, do you have any of these symptoms? And the whole page was symptoms. It was like skin and bloating, constipation, diarrhea, mood swings, brain fog, poor sleep, all of the above. And I would imagine that every single person on the airplane reading that magazine was, oh my God, I’ve got a thyroid problem. I’d have to have.
[00:18:30] So given the fact that our hormones govern so much of the way that we feel and think and respond to food, if we think that we’re struggling with our hormones, where on earth would we start?
Jema
That’s another million dollar question, isn’t it?
Stu
It is, yeah.
Jema
[00:19:30] To answer that, it’s different for men and for women. So like we operate differently and where would we start? For a woman it all begins with tracking your cycle. Now it’s kind of like the answer to a lot of questions is, oh but I’ve got bloating and I don’t know why I have it. The place to start is track your cycle. Plus it’s free. It doesn’t cost you anything. Because I know that today people really want cost-effective health mechanisms and tools. So tracking your cycle is completely free and there’s a few different ways you can do that. And just remind me to touch on hormones again and what you mentioned about thyroid but when it comes to tracking your cycle as a woman is that every day is going to look very different and there’s two ways you can track your cycle.
[00:20:00] You can get an app and track your cycle by an app, which is a really easy thing to do. People just download the app and it just works perfectly. But then the app, generally people, women normally use an app, let me say this really correctly, to track when they stop bleeding to get an idea when they ovulate. Now that could be because they just don’t want to conceive and they’re not ready to have a family. So they want to have safe sex practices so they want to know when they’re ovulating so that they don’t fall pregnant. Other women are like, oh well I’d like to know if I ovulate and I want to make sure I know how long my cycle is. So those just track the bleeding time. I believe what’s really important is tracking your cycle in a written tracker. You know, we’re kinesthetic human learners, so we learn by listening, like listening here on this podcast, watching the video on YouTube, and we learn by taking notes. So we learned three different ways.
Jema
[00:21:00]
So as a woman getting to know your hormones can generally start with tracking your cycle and it’s free, like I said. So that’s where you would track your day of your cycle. And I like to encourage women to write down three core words as to how you feel on the day. And there’s no structure to that. That could be, I’m feeling really hungry, or I’ve been really nervous or had a lot of fear come up to me today, or I’ve actually been full of energy. My energy is been really high, or I’ve been quite anxious and not feeling good and I’ve had a lot of sadness in my day. There’s no judgment. This is the thing with health. A lot of women judge themselves very quickly and we come from a society where we’re taught to judge, in the sense that we go to school and we work for the perfect grade. I want that A+. But then as soon as you get your results you like, what did you get? What did you get? And we judge ourselves and compare. So we have been brought up in this society where we do compare and judge. And so it’s not that there’s anything wrong with that.
It’s more so about the fact that, okay, when you’re recognizing how your feeling, is to really not have an attachment to it, it’s just a documentation. Like making a note at work, you’re just writing it down so that when you have a full cycle tracked, you can actually come back and reflect over different cycles and go, hang on a second, I’m bloated at this same time of my cycle every cycle. Maybe that has something to do with my hormones, or maybe that has something to do with my emotions or that time of my month. And every woman’s cycles different. Some women have a 28 day cycle, some are 30 days, some are 32 days. Some are 26, and it’s just what’s perfect for them, which is most important.
Stu
Bingo. Yeah. And again comes back to individuality. Like we’re all very different.
Jema
It totally does.
Stu
Okay, well let’s take it back a step then, let’s forget that we’re individual. Okay. And so now we’re kind of all the same. Tell me about-
Jema
Men and women or just all women?
Stu
I would say everyone. So we’re just on this earth. We’re kind of all the same. Now you have got a whole heap of experience in terms of mindset and motivation and nutrition and movement and sleep, no doubt. What are the quick wins then that we could put into practice right now that you think will have the biggest
… impact on our general health.
Jema
The quick wins. That’s a really great question. Sorry. I’m like, my charge is just not working on my computer. So, when it comes to the quick wins, tracking your cycle is a really easy thing to do to get started. The next step is simply connecting with yourself every single day. Connecting with yourself allows you to really hear and trust what your body is giving you.
[00:24:00]
So, when it comes to our body as women, and men, every human, every being, our body is consistently giving us messages. And this is what I call through ancestral health in PMS they’re period messages of self-care. But the little science, for example, when you get a headache and your body’s like, knock, knock, knock, “Hello. We’re feeling like this up here. Did you notice this?” Or when we’re constipated and we’re struggling going to the toilet, the body’s knocking on your door saying, “Hey, on the house.” Ancestrally they call the body the home, the house. So that the messages is knocking. The knock on the front door saying, “Hey, we’re here. I’m constipated right now. What can I do?”
[00:24:30] So, listening to your body, and that could be through a basic connection practice, which is simply sitting with yourself, taking in three nice long, deep breaths and just asking yourself, “How do I feel today?” So, listening to your body’s messages is so important. So that’s another little thing, a little win that you can do to check in. And I don’t feel enough people do check in with themselves every day.
It’s simple. You can even do it sitting at the traffic lights while you’re driving in the car. If you’re listening to this driving, you can do it right now when you get to the next set of traffic.
Stu
And I guess, how many people have … how many people would check into their email or their social, Facebook, Instagram, all of the above, but do we check into ourselves? So, note to self …
Jema
Note to self.
Stu
… switch off the phone.
Jema
[00:25:30]
Yeah. And it’s interesting for those who are listening who have children, we easily, I’m yet to be a parent myself, but working with so many moms, it’s so easy for us to check in with our kids. It’s like, “Oh, let’s look in their nappy. What’s their poo like? Oh, they’re not pooing today or they haven’t been to the toilet yet. I’ve had really low nappy changes.” You’ve become really inquisitive to want to know. Or they’ve got a rash. What does this mean? Imagine if we played or put that much attention onto the messages that our body was giving us because they’re the early signs as to what’s actually happening in our body.
So that’s a second win, a little thing you can do immediately. The third thing would be listen to how your body responds to food. So eating is important. We all know that. But if you’re wanting to discover what the perfect, in inverted brackets, diet is for you, is to acknowledge how you feel after you eat.
Acknowledge, okay, am I feeling really full? Am I feeling slightly bloated? Am I feeling really … the heat in my body is risen, or I’m still quite cold, or I’m feeling like it’s making me go to the toilet, or it’s not letting me go to the toilet? But tuning into that is a really easy thing to do. And there’s so many I could give you, but I’ll give you …
[00:27:00] I’ll say one more. Is that when it comes to a healthy thing you can do every day, is like a win for yourself, with food is, I’ve already said, if it comes from nature it’s generally good for you. Meaning it’s less packaged, it’s wholesome. Your body would have some memory on how to digest it. But eat colorful. If you want to feel colorful and have a radiant energy, then eating the colorful and radiant foods will enable that. So, don’t count anything. And this is coming from a woman who spent seven years writing out nutritional profiles for food. Don’t count the numbers. Most people don’t even know how to. The equation to get to a calorie from a kilojoule actually even works. Don’t count the numbers. Just count the number of colors on your plate, or in your bowl, or going into your smoothie blender. Just count the colors. And it’s not a lot.
Stu
Totally right. Because the numbers can be so confusing, especially when, as a nation we can be so fixated on calories.
Jema
Can’t we?
Stu
And thinking, “I need to lose weight. I’ve got to cut calories.” Well, nothing could be further from the truth, especially when you look at maybe something with zero calories. So, a can of diet soda for instance, versus an avocado. So, lots of calories, zero calories, one-
Jema
The source.
Stu
[00:28:00] Yeah, exactly right. One will be so health-giving and full of nutrients that can be so critical to our everyday health, and the other one empty calories that can impact gut health and just send us on this crazy train of wanting to grab more rubbish like that as well. So yeah, we’re really interested to count the nutrition, count the nutrients, count the goodness.
Jema
[00:28:30] And we’re inquisitive beings. Our mind likes to do something, and that’s why connecting and meditation can be very challenging for people because the mind like the busyness. Whereas if you give it something else to do, like count the colors, and we would encourage kids to do that, like, “Oh, what color’s the tomato? It’s red. What colors the carrot? It’s orange.” Where did we lose to do that as adults?
Stu
No, that’s good.
Jema
Easy.
Stu
[00:29:00] It’s good that you reminded of that as well, because I often, like when my daughters come out and they might themselves lunch, I say, “Well where’s the color?” Like, “What are you doing?” And they’ll toddle back in and get some vegetables and get more color on their plates. So, no, some really good … It’s a good pointer. So, tell me about … Everybody always wants to know what … Well, you’re the professional, what do you eat? How do you nourish yourself every day? So, what does a typical day look like in your diet?
Jema
[00:29:30] Wow, really good question. I like to say just with the way that I ate, I eat in tune with my cycle. So, our cycle, as a woman, is made up of four core phases, also linked to seasons. So, we have inner winter, inner spring, inner summer, inner autumn, they can be somewhat similar to the outer seasons. So, for me, my diet, on a daily basis, looks like, okay, what day of my cycle am I on? So, today I’m on day 16 of my cycle. That’s the day a couple of days after I’ve ovulated. So, I’m in inner summer. Inner summer’s the time where my body has more energy. So yesterday I had a lot of exertion of energy. I did a lot more physical movement than what I would on say, day eight or day six of my cycle.
[00:30:30]
So, my food at the moment is largely made up of more raw foods, lighter foods. And my digestive system and metabolism is a lot faster than what it is when I’m menstruating or leading into or post menstruation. So, for me, I like to, every week when I go shopping at the farmer’s market, just ensure that my … one, my basket is full of colorful food, and that I’ve got a range of different colors of my … “Oh, I don’t have any purple foods. Okay, I’ll have to get some beetroots or some purple cabbage or some berries.” But making sure it’s got lots of color and making sure that every day I have different elements.
Jema
So, I like to call it, when I teach one of my programs, making peace with your plate so that, “Okay, do I have healthy fats? Do I have healthy fiber? Do I have healthy amounts of carbs? Do I have healthy proteins?” And just giving it an overview, not getting stuck into the quantities of each, and allowing that to make up my meal. But above all else, Stu, I really just listen to my body.
[00:31:30]
So, this morning I got up, I made a tea, I took the tea to the beach with me. I sat and connected with myself before I went for a long walk, came back, did some yoga and swam. I still had no idea what I was going to have for breakfast. And then I got home, and I was like, “What do I feel like today? What is my body asking for today?” Today’s a little bit colder outside than what it has been, and I just allowed my body to respond with what it needed to. But if you’re listening to this, and you’re like, “How do you do that? How do you trust that, that’s your body asking, and not your ego saying, ‘You can totally have the chocolate for breakfast’?”
[00:32:00] And that simply comes down to, as a woman, I feel, the more you track your cycle, meaning just documenting how you feel on different days, the more naturally connected you’re becoming. So, connection isn’t just meditating every day. Connection is acknowledging everything your body is communicating with you. So just acknowledging, “Wow, my boobs are a little bit bigger today. Okay, what day of my cycle could I be on?” Or, “Wow, I am a little bit more constipated,” or, “I am a little bit more bloated today. What does that mean for me?” And just acknowledging those things.
[00:32:30] Then it’s the same with acknowledging your taste cravings. How are things [inaudible 00:32:17] for me? And doing that, women going on a tangent here, but I really feel the biggest challenge with women’s health is not having the confidence in food choices, and the confidence comes from the fact that we are surrounded by a world that runs on a 24 hour cycle as in like, “Okay, this is the best way to eat, but do it every day.”
[00:33:00] Or this is the best way to move. So, you make your schedule Monday to Friday, or to Sunday, of how you move every day. You go to Bootcamp three times, you might go to a yoga class, but then you need to do that same thing week on, week out, like every week. But for women, every week and every … Yeah, every week, which is every phase of our cycle, is going to be different. Therefore, the way that our body is craving things or asking for things, is going to be different.
[00:33:30] So, the confidence of a woman saying, “You know what? Right now, I know I haven’t had a smoothie in a while or I haven’t been having juices, but right now my body’s really craving this food.” And just trust that and listening to it. But then we’re like, “Oh, but I haven’t been to the gym in three days. And if I don’t go, my bum’s going to get bigger and I’m going to feel really uncomfortable in my body.” But it all comes back from just, one, listening to your body and trusting that, as a woman, it goes through a cycle, and it will never be the same.
Stu
[00:34:00] No, that’s a great answer. And I think it’s interesting as well, because we can get … it’s very easy for us to get on this bandwagon of doing the same things every day, each and every day, because habits are easy and they’re automatic, and we get up, we’re having breakfast and we’re going to have this. We always have this for breakfast and lunch. You know what, I’m just going to have this. And over the course of the week, you might have had the same breakfast, six or seven times. You might’ve had the same lunch and that will, in the long term, impact your diversity of your gut and all of the microbes and the bacteria in there as well, that are so important for health.
[00:35:00]
And so, I think the way that you’re talking about, well just how you’re feeling and every day is going to be different, and you’re going to be craving different things as well, will allow you to tap into variety. And variety, as they say, is the spice of life. And I think there’s huge meaning behind there as well. And so, it’s interesting that just tracking just makes it really, really easy to, I guess, recall how you were feeling the month before, the day before, the week before, and then probably allows you to be a little bit more informed as to where you … you’re making the right decisions because then you can track, “Well, I’m eating all this stuff and I’m actually feeling really good.”
Stu
So, yeah, I love the idea of tracking. And you mentioned app. Do you track all that in an app or do you diarize? What do you do?
Jema
[00:35:30] There’s two ways. An app or a written version. You can get some really great free apps. There’s loads out there now. And basically when, for a woman, day one of her cycle is the full day of bleeding. So, the first full day of bleeding you’re like, “Okay, that’s day one.” And most apps will then calculate approximately when you’ll ovulate, based on the fact that a healthy cycle, in inverted brackets, is a 28 or 29-day cycle.
[00:36:00]
[00:36:30] But some women, depending on their lifestyle, their environmental factors, they might have a 30-day cycle and it’s like that every cycle. Or another woman might have a 26, and the apps don’t really take that into account, whereas a written tracker is something that I encourage the women that I work with to do. There’s so many reasons to, because the first thing, it is a mini time for them. It takes less than three minutes to sit down, think about three things that you felt today, and write it down. And when on a written tracker you can link that with the moons to find out if you want to know, “Okay, am I near a full moon or a new moon?” Because that also plays into a woman’s makeup and her moods potentially too. But then you can actually have it … It’s like a school project.
[00:37:00] You can have three cycles, and I encourage a minimum two to three cycles to get an understanding of your cycle. You can have the three written trackers out in front of you and you can be like, “Oh my god, I actually feel really anxious at the same time of my cycle, every cycle. Okay. So, then my next cycle, I know that between day 18 and day 22 I’m going to feel anxious and that’s the time that I crave all of the ice cream, and the chocolate, and the bags of chips. So, knowing that, that’s my habit around my anxious time, how can I prepare my body?” And you can actually prepare your body up to two weeks before. So quite often our imbalances in our cycle come from an opposite side and the only way to really see that played out in front of you is writing it out on a tracker.
[00:38:00] It’s really hard with your phone to be able to go, “Okay, how do I … ” It’s like comparing different photos at the same time. You need [crosstalk 00:37:30] all laid out. So, the tracker is really helpful for that and I encourage … I’ve got girls as young as 14 tracking their cycles once they start menstruating, and it helps really balance their understanding of, “Oh, that’s why I feel like this today. Okay, that makes sense. My Body’s actually having this hormonal shift and that makes sense why I might feel a little bit more vulnerable, or confused, or more frustrated. And, therefore, I might seem to others like I’m really angry and snappy when in fact my body’s going through a change.”
Stu
Yeah, of course. It’s the stuff that we don’t see that is often the culprit. So-
Jema
The hidden things.
Stu
[00:38:30] It is. So, I noticed that you have a program, so the Well Woman program. And so, I’m keen to understand, a lot of the things that we’ve spoken about this morning, are they … do you elaborate more in the program? Have you got frameworks to assist as to try and get on top of all of that stuff?
Jema
[00:39:30] Yeah. Thanks for asking. The Well Woman program’s a program for women. I’m sorry men. But there is actually a really important facet of the program for men within the program. It’s a six-week online program, so you can be anywhere in the world. I have people from six different continents at the moment, who join me for the program. And it takes you through every phase of your cycle. So, the first week is all focused on understanding your makeup. So, as a woman, what does the endocrine system actually do? So, what is the thyroid’s responsibility? What is the pineal gland, the pituitary gland, the hypothalamus, the adrenals? And we talk about the core factors that throw the body off-balance because we have ease and then we have disease. So, we’re either diseased, which is, “I have a headache.” That’s also a dis-easement in the body versus in-ease. So, we talk about how to bring your body back into ease and then for the … every week we focus on a new phase.
[00:40:00] And when I talked earlier about linking your body with its eating, so tuning your body with your cycle and living in tune, it comes down to understanding that there’s four phases. Each phase requires slightly different foods. Your body’s going to move differently in different phases. The emotional factors will be different in different phases. If you look at the lifestyle factors, there’s some parts of your cycle where you’re on point creatively, and you’re like, “Yes, I can just write out … ” Like if you’re a writer, and you want to write out a blog post, it just comes so naturally. But then there’s another time of your cycle where it’s like, “I can’t get five sentences out, let alone 500 words,” is that there’s different lifestyle factors.
[00:40:30] So, the program teaches women innately about how their body works, but also about the different phases of their cycle and how you can literally live in tune with your body by understanding your phases. And then we link it all together with being able to live in flow and truly getting to know your body as a woman. We talk about, what I call, the three most important topics in health, and they’re a little bit crude, but I will share them. Poo. We all poo.
Stu
Yes. Yes, we do.
Jema
[00:41:00] Every person poos. Men and women. And we’ve been looking at poo since day dot. Our parents looked at our poo, and if you’re not looking at your own poo, I would encourage you to study your poo, because it tells you a lot about your health. The next one is sex. We all exist because of sex. It’s a topic that not many people speak about, but we all exist because of sex. And then the third one is periods. We also wouldn’t exist as humans if it wasn’t for the menstrual cycle.
[00:41:30] So, as women, it’s actually a massive part of our body and it plays a huge role in our health, but it’s one of the most under-taught aspects of a woman’s health. So, getting to know your cycle can really unlock so many reasons. “Oh, this is why I mentally feel like this,” or, “This is why I emotionally feel like this,” or, “This is why I’m really struggling with this workload.” Or, “I’ve been trying CrossFit all this time and it just doesn’t work for my body.” Instead of pushing yourself and forcing things, you can start to discover how you can allow them. So, that’s what the program is designed to do.
Stu
[00:42:30]
And you spoke about flow, and I love this because there are … we look at the body and each and every individual as having pillars of health. And we’ve got nutrition, and mindset, and stress, and sleep, and movement. All of the above. In terms of flow, so, you’re in the flow, everything’s working right, and you’re tracking everything, and everything seems to be coming together and you’re feeling great. On the flip side of that, what are the things that can quickly and easily knock us out of our flow? Perhaps the things that we might be gravitating to every day, that, unbeknownst to us, might be just whacking us in the completely opposite direction to where we want to be.
Jema
[00:43:00]
[00:43:30] I call these cycle disrupters. And for men, they’re … you have … I’m not just … when I say cycle disruptor, it’s not just women. Men have a cycle too. Just our hormone structure and endocrine system is slightly different. Women are built to make babies. Men are not built to make babies. So, you have a cycle as well. But when it comes to living in flow and in tune, these cycle disruptors apply to everybody. And flow isn’t bleeding. A lot of people think that flow is having the flow of your menstrual blood. No, no, no. Flow is how you wake up in the morning and go, “You know what? My body’s really craving stretching this morning. I’m going to stretch.” Or, “My body’s … You know what? I don’t need to go to that … ” for me, I go to yoga. “I don’t need to go to that really challenging Ashtanga class. I’m going to go to Yin Yoga instead.”
[00:44:00] So, flow is simply allowing your body to be your guide. Like your body be your GPS, literally. So, the two biggest disruptors is stress and sleep. And I’m sure a lot of the guests on this podcast have talked about stress. And as humans, we feel stressed very differently to the way that our ancestors once did. That’s the whole fight or flight, rest or digest thing. We have stress from relationships stress, work stress, study stress, financial stress, food choice decision stress and like, “Do I buy this? Do I not buy this? Do I make this? Do I not make this?” Decisions as in like, as a woman, like, ” What do I wear today? How should I do my hair?” That is also somewhat stress.
[00:45:00]
And then we have environmental stress, and we can’t escape those. We can’t escape the fact that you might live in an apartment block and have 40 Wi-Fi connections near you. Or you might carry your phone in your bag instead of your pocket, but that’s still there. So, stress as an endocrine disruptor, which is your reproductive system, is huge for both men and women. So, that’s the biggest challenge. So, I always say, “Look, let’s look at connecting with our bodies. Focus on what you can do for yourself first and foremost, and let that be a ripple effect onto the outside of you.” And what I mean by outside of you is like, when you fly, and I love to travel and I’m yet to have children, so I don’t have to fit the air mask for little people, but you always fit the air mask for yourself first. And that can sometimes be seen as selfish, but selfishness is actually self-care.
[00:45:30]
Jema
Making sure that you are drinking your water is self- care. So, look after your own self and what you can control within your environment, which is burgers don’t jump into your mouth. Yeah? It’s not like they’re just catapulting their way into your mouth. You choose. It’s a choice. And being really aware of your choices. So, what it is that you can control. You can control how you shop. You can control how you make your food. You can control how you eat. So, do you eat fast? Do you eat
… Flow. Do you breathe while you eat, do you drink while you eat? All of the things that you can choose and make choices around that are things we can control, which will largely help you with balancing out the disruptors. And then you have sleep, which is another topic, but if you think about it sleep also works on a rhythm. It works on a cycle, which is like our circadian rhythm and cycle. Just as our hormones work on a cycle, so sleep works on a cycle, we work on a cycle, our energy works on a cycle. So the way that we have our energy output and input, so we are beings. Animals have cycles too, we all have cycles, nature has a cycle, like the trees, they grow leaves, they drop the leaves, then they re-nourish into spring and then they re-sprout. So, we all have cycle, every living thing has a cycle.
[00:47:30]
So, when you embrace your cycles your can start to balance them, and sleep is a really important one, if you’re not getting adequate amounts of sleep for your body, because every sleep amount is different. The golden question is, so how many hours should I sleep, and how much water should I be drinking? It’s like well, how long is the piece of string? Do you move your body, do you sweat, do you sit in a chair all day, do you walk around? So, discovering that for yourself, but if you feel tired you need to sleep more.
Stu
Yup, oh good advice, and I am so transfixed on my own sleep, because I went through a period when sleep was bad a few years ago, and so I just became absolutely absorbed, obsessed even, about tracking my sleep.
Jema
A healthy obsession.
Stu
[00:48:00] Yeah, exactly right, because the ultimate goal is that I’m going to sleep better, and I’m going to be performing better in every sense of my body and every single day. So, yeah that’s my thing, I know how much REM sleep, and deep sleep I get every night, and I can know what my body temp is and all that kind of stuff, and just make little adjustments. So, I guess it comes back to your, how do you fee? Diarise what affects sleep, what really adds value to your sleep, and you can apply that to every day life as well.
Jema
Definitely.
[00:48:30]
Stu
Because take sleep away and you could quite easily become more stressed, which is what I wanted to touch on now. In terms of, now you’ve obviously got lots of strategies and you know doubt apply many of your strategies to yourself, and you’ve got your own little hacks, and tips and tricks that you apply to yourself.
Jema
The tool belt, I have a tool belt.
Stu
So, tell me, your tool belt then to manage stress, if you’re in a situation where you’re thinking, everything’s going wrong today, I am so out of flow, what do you gravitate to? Is there any particulars that you just go to, I know this is going to work for me, so I do this.
Jema
[00:49:30]
[00:50:00] Yes. There’s a handful, and the first one that I’ll share is I believe the utmost important, it’s something that we’ve been using for centuries and we forget about. We live in this world that’s so distracted, we have so many distractions that take us out of our body that we forget to step into the body. But the first one is the breath, I’m self employed, I run my business, I’ve been self employed for a number of years. It’s very easy for me to become overwhelmed, anxious that leads to stress. If I have deadlines and I’ve got back to back clients on a certain day, and I’m running a program, and I have an event I’m planning for the number one thing that I’ll and everyone who’s listening or watching just put your hand on your chest and take a long, deep breath in.
[00:50:30]
[00:51:00] So, it’s literally just an inhale, and an exhale. And if you can do three, do three of them together, that instantly just communicates to your body that you are safe. And doing that, it changes your nervous system, it changes your ability to digest, it changes your ability to assimilate, so like getting ready to go to the toilet. Just relaxing, but with using the breath. That’s the number one stress response, I would say is that if you are at all ever stressed, breathe. And my neighbor has, she’s like my adopted daughter, a two and a half year old and she can get really flustered quite easily. And I just hold her by her arms and I’ll look her in the eye, and I’ll be like, “Let’s breathe.” And it’s not until the third breath that she’s like, “Haaa.” And she’s forgotten about what she might’ve been anxious or stressed about.
So, breathing is one of the best tools, and it just takes less than 30 seconds, Ayurveda, so Indian medicine, they’ve been using it for centuries. You know the joy and passion of Pranayama, the method of the breath, so doing that. The first one is breath.
Stu
Great.
Jema
[00:52:00]
The second thing if you are ever stressed is go out to nature, get out there. There is a particular quote, and I’ve slightly altered it and I don’t remember where I saw it, because I’ve been using it for so long, or who I learnt it from. So, if this relates to someone please message me, and say, “Hey, it’s from this person.” I want to know. But it applies, everything that I teach Stu, relates to nature. Every element and day of your cycle as a woman, your menstrual cycle relates to a specific time of the year in nature. So, for us it comes down to spending more time in nature, and know nothing in nature rushes, but everything still gets done.
The little flower that’s a bud isn’t like, blossom, blossom, I want to blossom! It’s not forcing the blossom, it just naturally allows the blossom. The trees don’t drop all the leaves at the same time, and they don’t sprout all the leaves at the same time. They happen in turn with when the nature around them allows them to.
Stu
Yeah, I like that.
[00:52:30]
Jema
Yeah. So, nothing in nature rushes, everything still gets done. So, that’s the second one, and the third one for me spending time with nature, as a woman I’m very responsive with ocean. I’ve been swimming since I was six months old, my mum used to be a swim coach and a swim teacher. So, for me bodies of water are really important, so I live one and a half blocks from the beach, every day I go to the beach, even if it’s just for two minutes and I stand on the edge, I don’t even go on the sand.
[00:53:30]
And just looking at the water, and this is a great example for everybody listening, is that every single day the ocean is different, some days the ocean is six foot heavy swell, it could be cyclonic and windy. The next day it could be calm like a bay, and a one foot swell, meaning one foot waves. The ocean never rushes, it just follow its natural rhythm and it’s constantly turning over. So, looking at that as women is know that if you … And for men, if you feel really anxious, vulnerable, confused and frustrated on one day that’s the rage of the ocean and the rage of the sea, the next day could be completely calm. Don’t be attached to what is, just acknowledge what’s there.
[00:54:30] So, breathing, spending time in nature, and the ocean is really important. And the fourth one, and I’ll wrap it on the fourth one, because I could have lots, is that when you’re stressed support your body. And so for me that’s how I move, and how I eat, and eating falls through what I drink, so water. So, if you’re stressed, don’t top that up with a glass of wine or a cup of coffee. Stress means okay, my body’s looking for support, how could I support my body today? Don’t make it complicated because that’s when you’re most likely to talk yourself out of doing it. Just answer the question, or when you get home from work after a stressful day open the pantry, open the fridge and say, “What would support my body today?” And seek what supports, rather than what’s going to add additional stress.
Stu
Mm-hmm (affirmative). Now that is good advice, and so true about nature as well, because we’ve all got these great memories in our head of happy times, the best times of our live and i think very few of them will be times when we’re in the office working. We’re more than likely going to be-
Jema
Unless it’s this podcast interview.
[00:55:00]
Stu
Oh of course, this will now be the best time. But it would be, we’re going to be at the beach, we’re going to be in the mountains, we’re going to be in the forest, we’re going to be out with our family enjoying the sunshine and getting the vitamin D and just enjoying everything that nature has. So, that is good advice.
Jema
[00:55:30] It’s a homecoming, it’s like earlier I mentioned that our body is the house, the body is the home. You wouldn’t let someone with dirty feet enter your actual home and walked around uninvited, our body is the same, would you let dirty things in your body walk around uninvited whilst your body furiously works to get rid of them?
[00:56:30] With nature, the external world, that is also our home and so it’s like a dog, when the dog’s inside all day and you let it outside it’s like, yes I’m home! I can smell, I can look at the grass, and look at the sky. We’re the same. And for the listeners and the people watching, next time you are going outside of the city or a suburban area, just recognize how your body responds as you transition. So, where I live on the Gold Coast in Australia, I live very close like a 15 minute drive from being in the hills in a rainforest area. And as I drive to do a hike or see a waterfall, literally I can just fel myself sinking into the seat of my car, just being like, oh this is so nice and the trees are just blowing at their own pace, there’s no rush. Have you ever seen trees literally fight against the wind? It’s like don’t blow me over. No they just allow it. So, we can learn a lot from that, so when you’re stressed spending time in nature, even if it’s just on your lunch break, just spending five minutes outside in nature can seriously change how you feel and your body’s response.
Stu
[00:57:00] Oh, absolutely. Take your shoes and socks off, ground yourself, and there’s hard and fast science to back that up as well. Biological changes occur when you do this stuff, in your body, so I’m with you completely.
Jema
[00:57:30] I don’t know when shoes were invented, but we lived without shoes for so long and people, my friends know that I don’t really ever wear shoes, and it’s because you’re more connected so you can feel things, and it amplifies your senses, which means that you become more intuitive because that’s also a sense. So, yeah it’s a great one, getting connected. When you walk on the grass you actually feel the grass under your feet, notice how that texture feels on your feet.
Stu
Definitely.
Jema
That’s calming.
Stu
The little things can have the biggest impact over time, and I think if we can try and program some of these to become habits, just something that we do automatically every single day, then those are the one percenters that make the biggest affect. Because those one percenters add up at the end of the day.
Jema
Totally, and it’s not a rush. When I meet a new client for the first time, or someone joins the program, and they’re like give it to me, I want to do it all at once, I’m like, whoa. If you take the whole plan and you apply it all at once it’s going to be undoable for you, you’re not going to be able to do it long term, because it’s going to be overwhelming. Whether it’s overwhelming on day four or day 40, it will still be overwhelming.
[00:58:30] So, just take two things that you’ve learnt and apply them for two weeks, then take another two things apply them for another two weeks, take another two things and apply them for two weeks. So, if you’re wanting to add more fruits and vegetables to the way in which you eat, next time you’re at the shops or the farmers market just pick one fruit or vegetable that you’ve never brought before, and you don’t know how to use, buy it and just see how to use it that one week.
Stu
That’s right.
Jema
[00:59:00] And if you do that every week that’s 52 new … Every week for every year, that’s one whole year, it’s 52 new experiences of food. Imagine what your food’s going to look like in a years time?
Stu
Exactly right, small steps.
Jema
So easy.
Stu
I don’t think that anybody ever started to climb Mount Everest by climbing Mount Everest. They probably started by walking round the block.
Jema
Exactly.
Stu
So, it’s good advice.
Jema
Yes, don’t rush that, take time it’ll be a long term change.
[00:59:30]
Stu
Exactly right, so I’m conscious of the time, we’re coming up on time, and there’s a question that I ask every guest and I’m just super intrigued about your non-negotiables, the things that you do every day that you have to do every day to ensure that your day works out to be the best day ever, again, and again, and again. Now I’m guessing that I already know a few answers in there because you’ve touched on it, but just walk us through the things that you have to do that make you feel the best version of yourself.
[01:00:00]
Jema
Yeah, this is great. I actually have on my website seven simple steps to simple daily health. It’s like a free e-book you can get, and they’re the seven steps that I do every day, and as I list them out don’t make them complicated like we just spoke about Stu, for those listening.
[01:00:30] Number one is breathe, our body naturally breathes for us, but we can actually increase and enhance how we breathe, so just breathe and that could be when you find yourself rushing. Just take a deep breath, so breathing is number one.
Number two is nourish, which is nourishing food, and sometimes you can’t be in control of your food choices when you’re eating out with friends, when you go to a wedding, when you’re traveling. But always make healthy choices, those burgers or those donuts, or that chocolate or whatever it is doesn’t jump in your mouth, you place it there so know what you’re putting in is going to be your supportive nourishment.
Number three is hydrate, our body requires water, and water isn’t tea, and it’s not a Super Greens drink, water is water, even though those things are great too. But staying hydrated, a lot of our health imbalances and challenges can be assisted with just drinking more water. So, if you’re craving food or you’re emotionally overeating, drink more water. So number three is hydrate.
[01:02:00]
Number four is move, every day I have to move my body. In my menstrual cycle there’s a time of our body where our body actually does not want any abdominal tension, so no ab work, nothing that requires tension there. And that for me looks like I do literally laying down on my back in a Savasana position breathing, that is my movement practice for the day. And what am I moving? I’m moving my breath, I’m moving my nervous system, I’m moving my blood through my body. That is also movement, so movement doesn’t have to be running, or walking ,or swimming, or going to the gym, or lifting weights. Movement is just ensuring that you’re not static. In Aravada … I could talk about this forever, but the [inaudible 01:02:08] is static versus mobility, just ensure you’re moving, being mobile.
Stu
Okay.
Jema
[01:02:30] So, that’s number four. Then we have, have a daily focus on liver and gut health, if you’re doing the first four you’ve automatically got a focus on liver and gut health, so it’s not an extra to do. But you could do that with a pharmaceutic ally graded probiotic, you can do that with lots of lemon and green foods, but that’s number five.
[01:03:00] Number six is ensuring that you work really well with your environment. So, if you do the first five number six will naturally occur. You will naturally want to be around different places, you’ll want to have a window at work and not fluorescent lights. So, over time you can change your environment, but that’s not the first step, it’s the last thing, it’s the ripple. So, your environment, I always ensure that I get fresh air, that I have natural light, that my space is open minded, so it helps me have an open mind.
[01:03:30] And the last but not least is one that I feel a lot of people can easily miss, but it’s a very ancestral thing, is passion. Every day do something that you’re passionate about. I teach this in one of my programs, and that might be passionately cooking, might be passionately talking on the phone to a loved one. It might be passionately texting, or walking passionately, whatever it is. Passion creates joy and happiness, and helps reverse those cycle disruptors we spoke about.
Stu
Boy oh boy, so much knowledge. So much knowledge.
Jema
Don’t worry, that’s it.
Stu
No, that was fantastic, really, really good. So, I’m just, boy there’s so much to take in, that is excellent. So, tell me, what’s next, what have you got coming up, you got trips, programs, what’s on the board?
Jema
[01:04:30]
I do have trips, I head to America for a conference in two weeks, which I go to every year, I’m very excited about. We have another Well Woman program starting in September, which is crazy, it’s only a few weeks away, which i very excited about and I’m actually on the sidelines, working on a program for schools to teach girls about the same education I teach women. But it’s about if we can teach them from a younger age about better body confidence, and why they feel maybe unconfident in their body, or what the changes are. Why girls maybe feel emotional on one day versus another, it can really help avoid challenges in health later down the track, and it’s something I’m so passionate about, because being in my 30s I’ve seen a lot of my friends go through cycle challenges, and fertility challenges, and emotional and mental challenges too.
[01:05:00] Which all could have been back when they started menstruating, if they had have just learnt to openly talk and discuss it, and to know that it’s okay to not feel amazing in your body on a particular day. You don’t have to feel amazing every day, so that’s what I’m working on, and I’m really excited about it. So, hopefully this will roll out very soon.
Stu
[01:05:30] And it’s great to hear that you are following your passion, you’re doing what you love because that gives you life’s purpose, and there’s no greater thing than following your passion and purpose in life. Fantastic.
Stu: So, for everybody then out there listening to this that wants to know more, where would we send them?
Jema
[01:06:00] Awesome, so you guys can just head to my website, its wellsome, W-E-L-L-S-O-M-E, wellsome.com. You can actually get a free Love Your Cycle tracker on my website, you can also head to my Instagram, it’s my social platform I love to play around on. It’s wellsome, W-E-L-L-S-O-M-E, underscore Jemalee, which is J-E- M-A-L-E-E for those who like the G-E-M-M-A spelling. And I hang out there in my link tree, there’s lots of links you can connect with me. Id love to hear from you, message me if there’s a question I didn’t answer, or you have. Come and say hi, I’d love to connect with you and you can learn all about what I do on my website, and connect with me there too.
Stu
[01:06:30] Fantastic Jema, we will put all of the links in the show notes, and send all of the traffic as well to the right places. So, again, thank you so much for your time, so much valuable information, cannot wait to share it with our audience.
Jema
Thank you so much for having me Stu, and hopefully I’ll have to have you on my podcast when it goes live soon, the Well Women podcast, and I’d love to have you on.
Stu
Well there is the word man in woman, so I think that-
Jema
It is. Yes. It is in there, and woo man, that’s what women do we woo man.
Stu
Well there you go, I would very much, I accept the challenge. Sounds good.
Jema
Fantastic.
Stu
All right.
[01:07:00]
Jema
Thanks so much for having me.
Stu
[You talk soon 01:07:01], bye-bye.
Jema
Bye.
